World of Warcraft®

"Everyone cheers him for his part in getting Teldrassil cleansed and purified of the Nightmare's taint, but they forget that he also fought against getting the World Tree properly blessed! Said that it was time the night elves actually lived in their world. Death was welcome! You might say that he killed your precious Shalasyr, Jarod! She would be just fine forever immortal, if he had not decided he knew best for all of us!"
-Maiev, Wolfheart

Now, you might not like Malfurion, or that he might point out the cons to being immortal, especially when it comes be being immortal versus saving the world, but looking at the chain of events we have to deal with, Malfurion pretty much never has the opportunity to turn down or deny the restoration of the Night Elves' immortality. Really, before the growing of Teldrassil, Maiev's claims might be somewhat wrong, as there is little proof that Malfurion did argue against blessing Teldrassil, nor would it have been his choice for those blessings to be granted in the first place.

To start, from the original World of Warcraft Night Elves intro, what we are told is that Malfurion gave Fandral

"warnings that nature would never bless such a selfish act"

From what little phrasing this gives us we don't know much more about those warning. We don't know if Malfurion tried to forbid Fandral from growing Teldrassil, nor do we have a statement that he tried to talk anyone out of giving blessings to Teldrassil. What we actually do know is that Malfurion wouldn't have even gotten the chance to do so whether or not he would want to.

Throughout the revamped Teldrassil in the Night Elf starting zone quests we are met by a Shade of the Kaldorei and given an overview of the Night Elves' history since the Battle of Mount Hyjal.

Shade of the Kaldorei says:

Much has changed for our people since the Battle of Mount Hyjal.

Nordrassil lies a pale shadow of what it once was, its power used to defeat Archimonde and drive back the Burning Legion.

Our immortality-the very essence of our beings!-was lost.

The Betrayer was freed from his prison, and Shan'do Stormrage disappeared into the emerald dream.

A dark time for all.

With Malfurion Stormrage gone, the druids were left in disarray and in desperate need of a new leader.

Arch Druid Fandral Staghelm roused the druids and convinced the Circle of Ancients in Darkshore that it was time for our people to rebuild.

In an effort to regain immortality for our people, and with the approval of the Circle, Staghelm and the most powerful druids grew Teldrassil, upon whose boughs you now stand.

Though we have our new home, our immortal lives have not been restored.

The Arch Druid approached the dragons for their blessings, as the dragons had placed on Nordrassil in ancient times.

But Nozdormu, Lord of Time, refused to give his blessing, chiding the druid for his arrogance.

In agreement, Alexstrasza also refused Staghelm, and without her blessing, Teldrassil's growth has been flawed and unpredictable.

Staghelm retreated to his enclave in Darnassus, ever seeking a new direction by which to bless Teldrassil, and restore the immortality of our people.

In weeks past, all of those living atop Teldrassil have found their memories blurry, as if time itself seized a portion of their lives.

We break from this haze to find that Fandral Staghelm and many of his closest followers have disappeared without a word.

But in his place, Shan'do Stormrage awoke from the dream and returned to his beloved Tyrande Whisperwind.

And with his return came Alexstrasza and Ysera, to at long last offer their blessings upon Teldrassil.

Though a small corruption lingers, desperately longing to be cleansed, the boughs of Teldrassil itself seem changed. Growth has begun anew.

None know what to expect next, but with Malfurion and Tyrande reunited, a new hope dawns on the Kaldorei.

Hope for lasting relief from the shadow that has been cast on our people for so long.

So what we have is that Fandral proposed growing Teldrassil, Malfurion warned Fandral that this would not restore our immortality, and then Malfurion disapears. From the novel Stormrage it is revealed than Fandral himself was the one who made Malfurion disappear by using Morrowgrain to poison him and keep him in the Emerald Dream.

It is then not until After Malfurion has been cut off from the world that Fandral went ahead and grew Teldrassil, and not until after the tree was grown that Fandral went to get the blessings from the Aspects. Malfurion, being kept away by Fandral, couldn't have made any arguments against the blessing of Teldrassil at this time, as Fandral made sure that Malfurion couldn't have been there to say anything at all.

It turned out Malfurion's warnings were right, however, at least indirectly. Nozdormu refused the blessing. It was Nozdormu who denied the Night Elves the restoration of their immortality. Now it might have been because of Fandral's arrogance in creating such an unnatural tree, or it might have been because of Fandral's breaking of the union between the dragons and the Night Elves and in turn tainting Nozdormu's opinion of all people. But for whatever reason it was, Alexstrasza agreed with Nozdormu and did not grant her blessing, either.

Though it would turn out that Alexstrasza blessing was irrelevant to the Night Elves' immortality, as would be Ysera's blessing. With the conclusion of Stormrage, which the Shade of the Kaldorei described as, "In weeks past, all of those living atop Teldrassil have found their memories blurry, as if time itself seized a portion of their lives," Fandral was defeated, Malfurion saved by Tyrande awakens from the dream, and Alextrasza and Ysera give Teldrassil their blessings.

Yet the Night Elves are still mortal. Nor did Malfurion argue against Alextrasza and Ysera blessing Teldrassil. He didn't stop them, nor tell them to water down their blessings so that the Night Elves wouldn't be immortal. But ultimately it was once again Nozdormu who had the ultimate say in whether or not the Night Elves would be immortal.

But the problem is that Nozdormu wasn't around. From the beginning of World of Warcraft, Norzdormu had been missing. We deal with his broods, fight against C'Thun and his Qiraji and Silithid for them, and then throughout Burning Crusade and Wrath of the Lich King we fight against the Infinite Dragonflight for them. But even when Malfurion finally awakens, Nozdormu is nowhere to be found.

During Wolfheart, where Maiev accuses Malfurion of arguing against blessing Teldrassil Nozdormu was still missing in action and wouldn't have been around to even listen to any such arguments, whether or not they were made. It was not until long after this claim that Nozdormu would come back to the world. Not until after the revamped events of Darkshore and not until after the initial questing through Hyjal. Not until Thrall: Twilight of the Aspects where Thrall finally brings Nozdormu back to the world.

As such, from before the time of Teldrassil's growth, all the way until far after Maiev accused Malfurion of denying the Night Elves immortality, Malfurion wouldn't ever have even gotten the chance to make any such denials. Regardless of whether he wanted to or not.

This leaves only one small window in which something odd occurred. In Rage of the Firelands, Malfurion is awake and Nozdormu is present. Nordrassil is healed and in such a way that it implies it heals Azeroth and closes all the rifts and weaknesses between Azeroth and the Elemental Planes. We don't get to see this. For all intensive purposes this should have restored the Night Elves' immortality, too. But, as we see in Mists of Pandaria, it does not.

For whatever reason, Nozdormu did not make the Night Elves immortal again, and now he has lost any chance to do so, as shortly after returning to the world, Nozdormu, and the whole world for that matter, had to use all its force to deal with Deathwing. And in turn, Nozdormu, and all the Aspects, lost their power. Nozdormu, now as mortal as the Night Elves themselves, cannot bless either Teldrassil or Nordrassil.

Why didn't he? We don't know. I would say it's most likely because he was too preoccupied. Between the revelation that he would be responsible for the Infinite Dragonflight, having to plan and alter the timeline to grab the Dragon Soul from the past while working around the mechanization that prevent him from doing so by his own future self, and then having to prepare and use the Dragon Soul immediately, there was probably just no time or maybe even thought given to restoring the Night Elves' immortality.

One could also suggest that in this short window of time between coming back to the world and no longer being the Aspect of Time Malfurion could have gone up to Nozdormu and told him not to make the Night Elves immortal. But we have no actual evidence of this. So ultimately, while Malfurion might note that there are reasons why being mortal might be beneficial within all the reasons it would not be, as far as canon goes, Malfurion hasn't ever actually denied the Night Elves the restoration of their immortality.

TL;DR:

Malfurion could not have denied the Night Elves their immortality.

A fair analysis of how Malfurion couldn't have been involved though I'll note one untraced thread. Nozdormu is in charge of the timeline. Whether or not he's present, he can be presumed to be aware of when his powers need to be called upon.

I would like to continue a bit on Nozdormu's actions and motivations though. Yes, he laid the original blessing on Nordrassil granting the night elves immortality. He had a reason for doing so, because the night elves were called upon to protect the new Well of Eternity one of their own had so rashly recreated. Nozdormu being Lord of Time that he is, presumably was aware that the actions the night elves and Malfurion took in Warcraft 3 would be needed. This fulfilled their duty and consequently their need for immortality. The Well is now defended by other peoples as well now, and its existence is no longer quite so secret.

This is something it seems a number of posters have missed. Immortality was not a freely-given gift because the night elves are just so awesome. It was a boon that was necessary for the task they were undertaking. It is not some birthright of theirs or something they deserve, it was just something that was required for a time (a fairly long time, I will grant). Their continued seeking of that longevity IS selfish, and there is no good reason they should get it.

I'll get to the rest of this in a bit... But for the second poster..

This is something it seems a number of posters have missed. Immortality was not a freely-given gift because the night elves are just so awesome. It was a boon that was necessary for the task they were undertaking. It is not some birthright of theirs or something they deserve, it was just something that was required for a time (a fairly long time, I will grant). Their continued seeking of that longevity IS selfish, and there is no good reason they should get it.

No.. No. no no. No no. No. And, for good measure. Another no.

The immortality from Nozdormu was NOT a reward for guardianship. It was not a gift "freely given". It wasn't a "gift" at all. It was compensation. Compensation for putting a giant tree on the new Well that would have stopped it from making the Elves immortal like the first one.

There is no bargain except between Druids and Ysera. The Aspects did not charge the Night Elves with a task. The whole "rawr, guard the world tree from any external threats" thing never happened. Nozdormu SPECIFICALLY says "No matter what path the Night Elves may take" when blessing the tree. You know what that isn't? A task. That's pretty much flat out saying the opposite of it being a task, because they can do whatevs.

And you know what? That makes sense. No, no it does. Because, and think about this here. The World Tree survived an explosion and continued to cap the Well of Eternity. An explosion that killed on of the strongest known beings in the universe.

So, you know... That whole bit about the "rawr it wasn't a birthright" is, well. Wrong.. Atleast, no more than saying you having two arms is a birthright. Or a nose. Because Immortality is something the Night Elves ALWAYS had. The Well made them immortal pre-sundering.

There was no gift. There was no charge. And you know what? The situation hasn't changed at all. The Night Elves can still get that immortality back by chopping away at ol'Nordy. That tree still stands, and compensation should still be given. Because, you know, the Aspects just provided a clean alternative. Think of it like solar power instead of oil.

Ohh, yeah, and before we get to the whole "it can't be done again thing" I'm just gonna have to remind you that the original world tree was blessed by depowered aspects as well.

I'll get to the rest of this in a bit... But for the second poster..

This is something it seems a number of posters have missed. Immortality was not a freely-given gift because the night elves are just so awesome. It was a boon that was necessary for the task they were undertaking. It is not some birthright of theirs or something they deserve, it was just something that was required for a time (a fairly long time, I will grant). Their continued seeking of that longevity IS selfish, and there is no good reason they should get it.

No.. No. no no. No no. No. And, for good measure. Another no.

The immortality from Nozdormu was NOT a reward for guardianship. It was not a gift "freely given". It wasn't a "gift" at all. It was compensation. Compensation for putting a giant tree on the new Well that would have stopped it from making the Elves immortal like the first one.

There is no bargain except between Druids and Ysera. The Aspects did not charge the Night Elves with a task. The whole "rawr, guard the world tree from any external threats" thing never happened. Nozdormu SPECIFICALLY says "No matter what path the Night Elves may take" when blessing the tree. You know what that isn't? A task. That's pretty much flat out saying the opposite of it being a task, because they can do whatevs.

And you know what? That makes sense. No, no it does. Because, and think about this here. The World Tree survived an explosion and continued to cap the Well of Eternity. An explosion that killed on of the strongest known beings in the universe.

So, you know... That whole bit about the "rawr it wasn't a birthright" is, well. Wrong.. Atleast, no more than saying you having two arms is a birthright. Or a nose. Because Immortality is something the Night Elves ALWAYS had. The Well made them immortal pre-sundering.

There was no gift. There was no charge. And you know what? The situation hasn't changed at all. The Night Elves can still get that immortality back by chopping away at ol'Nordy. That tree still stands, and compensation should still be given. Because, you know, the Aspects just provided a clean alternative. Think of it like solar power instead of oil.

Ohh, yeah, and before we get to the whole "it can't be done again thing" I'm just gonna have to remind you that the original world tree was blessed by depowered aspects as well.

Source? The War of the Ancients trilogy, seeing as it encompasses two different timelines and was mostly written before WoW's release, is both a touch confusing and outdated. The equally outdated in-game books covering the period do mention Malfurion making a pact and the night elves receiving a charge, before the blessings were granted. What more relevant sources are you claiming say otherwise?

And the dragons were not disempowered before. They'd given up SOME of their power to invest in the artifact. They were helpless before the artifact holding their essence and they were weaker than Neltharion. Not the same thing. Now they really are disempowered.

A fair analysis of how Malfurion couldn't have been involved though I'll note one untraced thread. Nozdormu is in charge of the timeline. Whether or not he's present, he can be presumed to be aware of when his powers need to be called upon.

I would like to continue a bit on Nozdormu's actions and motivations though. Yes, he laid the original blessing on Nordrassil granting the night elves immortality. He had a reason for doing so, because the night elves were called upon to protect the new Well of Eternity one of their own had so rashly recreated. Nozdormu being Lord of Time that he is, presumably was aware that the actions the night elves and Malfurion took in Warcraft 3 would be needed. This fulfilled their duty and consequently their need for immortality. The Well is now defended by other peoples as well now, and its existence is no longer quite so secret.

This is something it seems a number of posters have missed. Immortality was not a freely-given gift because the night elves are just so awesome. It was a boon that was necessary for the task they were undertaking. It is not some birthright of theirs or something they deserve, it was just something that was required for a time (a fairly long time, I will grant). Their continued seeking of that longevity IS selfish, and there is no good reason they should get it.

Except that the Night Elves as a race haven't done anything to warrant being deprived of the immortality that was granted to them. By your analysis, Nozdormu granted the Night Elves immortality because it fell to them to defend the new Well of Eternity. How does the knowledge of the well by other races and their efforts to protect it mean that the Night Elves should no longer be immortal when immortality was used as a means to help its warders keep the well safe?

I do not know the full benefits of immortality, but among them is a knowledge of the distant past, and a multitude of experiences and time to observe world changes from the most broad and overarching to the most minuscule and hardly perceptible. Within this time, an immortal can learn trades, skills, disciplines and other bodies of knowledge that take a lifetime to learn, even several, and from the knowledge of several of them, a varied perspective and wisdom whose profundity is hard to fathom is within reach. These are extremely powerful tools only available to those who have the time of life to devote to them, namely immortals. So why would those who have or had the power to bestow such a thing deny it to those they charged with the task of defending the world tree?

Are the Night Elves now relieved of their duty? As should be quite clear by now, this has absolutely nothing to do with selfishness, but everything to do with their ability to do what the Aspects and Ancients appointed them specifically to do to the very best of their ability. I do not see how the inclusion of other races should have any affect on whether the Night Elves regain their immortality or not. As you said, it was not a freely-given gift, but a tool that aided them in the task they were appointed to. So why would they be denied the reacquisition of that tool whose use they knew well, and to my knowledge did not abuse since they were under the guidance of the Guardian Ancients throughout the entirety of their immortality, especially when Nordrassil was falling under dire threat yet again? Why also would they be denied this tool when the Guardian Ancients have returned and would not only be in a position to guide them, but also themselves could benefit from the powers over nature the Night Elves had while they were immortal to heal the damages wrought by the events leading up to the Firelands?

I am not seeing any justification for the Night Elves being refused their immortality, save the characterizations posed by certain authors, having nothing to do with the history of the Night Elves, and completely failing to address the perspectives of their benefactors beyond Malfurion. I am seeing rationalizations, but the Dragon Aspects should be well beyond that. And if Ferlion is right, and the Night Elves were not tasked with protecting the well, what did they do or fail to do that made them undeserving of reattaining their immortality, especially when it was a means for them to do some of the most unselfish acts a group of people can do?

Somehow I imagine that Velen and Malfurion would not get along well.

V: Elune is a naaru.
M: Yeah, well, immortality is bad and you should feel bad.

Source? The War of the Ancients trilogy, seeing as it encompasses two different timelines and was mostly written before WoW's release, is both a touch confusing and outdated

Yeah, no. The first book was released before WoW was. Maybe the second, but it was the same month.

It also takes priority over the "original" timeline of WC3 as its the most recent lore.

As for the immortality before thing, the WoW encyclopedia says as much, an it's been confirmed to still be canon.

The equally outdated in-game books covering the period do mention Malfurion making a pact and the night elves receiving a charge,

Funny that.. Actually, they don't.

They mention Malfurion making a pact, and he wasn't the leader of the Night Elves. More, it's specifically between him and the three aspects. The Night Elves were given no charge. Even the in game book says the tree was a symbol reflecting the Night Elves bond to nature, not a charge or contract.

To be fair, that does constitute a bit of a retcon because the ingame book says Druids were the leaders. We now know this to be false. Dems da breaks.

Except that the Night Elves as a race haven't done anything to warrant being deprived of the immortality that was granted to them.

As a race? They've never had a right to immortality. They received it by settling near and screwing around with a fount of arcane power they should never have touched and they lost it by destroying said fount to prevent the world from being entered and destroyed by the dark entity their race attracted with their unwise meddling.

By your analysis, Nozdormu granted the Night Elves immortality because it fell to them to defend the new Well of Eternity. How does the knowledge of the well by other races and their efforts to protect it mean that the Night Elves should no longer be immortal when immortality was used as a means to help its warders keep the well safe?

My analysis is that the LORD OF TIME granted them immortality to ensure that events played out the way they did in Warcraft 3. A long dead Malfurion, Tyrande, Illidan, and everyone else who participated in the two Burning Legion invasions means the seizure of the Well by the Legion and a failure on the part of Nozdormu as an Aspect empowered by the Titans to defend Azeroth.

09/09/2013 01:54 PMPosted by Ferlion

Source? The War of the Ancients trilogy, seeing as it encompasses two different timelines and was mostly written before WoW's release, is both a touch confusing and outdated

Yeah, no. The first book was released before WoW was. Maybe the second, but it was the same month.

It also takes priority over the "original" timeline of WC3 as its the most recent lore.

I said written, not published.

Ferlion is actually right.

From the in game book The Kaldorei and the Well of Eternity ( http://www.wowhead.com/object=21583 ):

"The lake, which would later be called the Well of Eternity, was the true heart of the world's magic and natural power. Drawing its energies from the infinite Great Dark beyond the world, the Well acted as a mystical fount, sending its potent energies out across the world to nourish life in all its wondrous forms.

In time, a primitive tribe of nocturnal humanoids cautiously made their way to the edges of the mesmerizing, enchanted lake.

The feral, nomadic humanoids, drawn by the Well's strange energies, built crude homes upon its tranquil shores. Over time, the Well's cosmic power affected the strange tribe, making them strong, wise and immortal. The tribe adopted the name Kaldorei, which meant -children of the stars- in their native tongue. To celebrate their budding society, they constructed great structures and temples around the lake's periphery."

Additionally, in the in game book The War of the Ancients ( http://www.wowhead.com/object=175727 ):

"Malfurion, convinced that the Well of Eternity was the demons' umbilical link to the physical world, insisted that it should be destroyed. His companions, knowing that the Well was the source of their immortality and powers, were horrified by the rash notion. Yet Tyrande saw the wisdom of Malfurion's theory, so she convinced Cenarius and their comrades to storm Azshara's temple and find a way to shut the Well down for good."

I can theorize the following:
Ferlion is right, Nordrassil effectively prevents the new Well of Eternity from granting the Night Elves immortality, because Nordrassil has cut off the Well of Eternity from its source of power. That is to say, the Burning Legion, and Sargeras in specific, was brought in through the Well of Eternity - likewise, the Sunwell, a miniature version of the Well of Eternity, was used to bring Kil'Jaeden through - because the Well(s) could actively draw from the Great Dark, which overlapped with the Twisting Nether, which the Burning Legion is found in. I believe Nordrassil prevents this possibility by severing Hyjal's Well of Eternity connection to the Great Dark - and inversely, the Sunwell has no mechanism blocking it, so once it was reactivating it was pouring out magic energy for the Blood Elves again, but could also be used to draw in the powerful demons, but now that a powerful source of light energy would screen the demons out. But, because Nordrassil cuts off the connection to the Great Dark, Hyjal's Well of Eternity is no longer drawing energies out, either. It no longer has the energy to make the Night Elves immortal.

So, Ferlion is right, the Night Elves probably could get their immortality back if they removed Nordrassil. They would also probably destroy the world in doing so. Nordrassil is integrally linked and infused into the whole of Azeroth, as it is Nordrassil's life energy that now flows through the world in place of the Well of Eternity's energies from the Great Dark. Theoretically, one might be able to switch back on the Well of Eternity before bad things would happen from removing Nordrassil's energy, but as we see from Archimonde and Ragnaros, destruction of the tree would be so devastating and rapid that there would probably be no time to reactivate the Well of Eternity. And even if they did, like with what happened when the Sunwell was reactivated, the Well of Eternity would then be useable again to create a portal for the Burning Legion, which was what Nordrassil was grown to prevent in the first place.

So, yes, Nozdormu's blessing was a substitute for the immortality given by the Well of Eternity. Why Norzdormu did not re-bless Nordrassil we still don't know.

The night elves (well, Malfurion) destroyed the original Well. Most (i.e. everyone but the quel'dorei and Illidan) were appalled that it had been created anew and didn't want it or what came from it. The only reason they didn't destroy it themselves was because they feared another Sundering. What's the purpose of giving them a substitute when they're already rejecting the original?

The Night Elves feared the use of the Well of Eternity to allow the Burning Legion onto Azeroth. I don't think they had anything against it granting them immortality, and even if Malfurion can see reasons why being mortal has some benefits, I doubt anyone ever actually rejected immortality.

Except that the Night Elves as a race haven't done anything to warrant being deprived of the immortality that was granted to them.

As a race? They've never had a right to immortality. They received it by settling near and screwing around with a fount of arcane power they should never have touched and they lost it by destroying said fount to prevent the world from being entered and destroyed by the dark entity their race attracted with their unwise meddling.

And so how does this make them undeserving of it now, since they ostensibly have sacrificed their immortality twice to save the world? Is there any other race that has done an equally selfless act? However, if Nozdormu was willing to grant them immortality a second time which is the time period of the Long Vigil, how were they not deserving of that when they sacrificed it to save the world before this time period, and were using the renewed immortality as a means of protecting it eternally, hence the name "The Long Vigil"?

You also failed to answer these questions I asked earlier:

So why would they be denied the reacquisition of that tool whose use they knew well, and to my knowledge did not abuse since they were under the guidance of the Guardian Ancients throughout the entirety of their immortality, especially when Nordrassil was falling under dire threat yet again? Why also would they be denied this tool when the Guardian Ancients have returned and would not only be in a position to guide them, but also themselves could benefit from the powers over nature the Night Elves had while they were immortal to heal the damages wrought by the events leading up to the Firelands?

By your analysis, Nozdormu granted the Night Elves immortality because it fell to them to defend the new Well of Eternity. How does the knowledge of the well by other races and their efforts to protect it mean that the Night Elves should no longer be immortal when immortality was used as a means to help its warders keep the well safe?

My analysis is that the LORD OF TIME granted them immortality to ensure that events played out the way they did in Warcraft 3. A long dead Malfurion, Tyrande, Illidan, and everyone else who participated in the two Burning Legion invasions means the seizure of the Well by the Legion and a failure on the part of Nozdormu as an Aspect empowered by the Titans to defend Azeroth.

Your final paragraph does not adequately answer the question you quoted. "How does the knowledge of the well by other races… mean that the Night Elves should no longer be immortal…?" Now read the rest of the question again because the details I omitted here for simplicity add an important complexity that your answer failed to address.

I would like to add to that, why did he then grant immortality to the whole race, and not just to those few? Maybe because the race itself needed to possess this knowledge, possibly? If they would need it at the end of the Long Vigil, wouldn't they need it in the future? Even if the rest of the world didn't need the Night Elves collectively to have immortality, wouldn't the world as a whole benefit from them having continued possession of it? If not, why? Why wouldn't a race that operates under the benefaction and direct guidance of life preserving and nourishing forces (the Ancient Guardians and the Dragon Aspects themselves), who have shown that they can be responsible with immortality for 10,000 years, be deserving of immortality when it is a tool they use to protect and nourish the world as a whole?

This argument about whether the night elves made a pact with the dragon aspects to guard the tree is fairly irrelevant, actually. The night elves never make the argument that they're seeking immortality because the world needs them as its protectors. As far as all evidence presented in any canon source I'm aware of suggests, they want to be immortal for the same reason most anyone would...because living forever is awesome.

And that is selfish.

It is a completely selfish desire that they want for their own benefit.

And...how is that a bad thing?

Curing polio is an example of the human race being selfish in real life. So's inventing agriculture. And that whole thing where we built roads? Totally selfish. Actually, almost every major invention, discovery, and scientific or cultural advancement in history. We make these things to improve life for ourselves and our people. And as long as we don't hurt anyone else or do long term damage to the planet in pursuit of our selfish goals, I see absolutely nothing wrong with them. And there's absolutely nothing wrong with the night elves trying to advance and improve themselves either. Every race in WOW pursues selfish goals to advance themselves. Some do so ethically, others use horrifically evil means, but they all do it. Humans want to reclaim ancestral lands, dwarves want to learn their history, forsaken seek to reproduce, and orcs want natural resources. The tauren wanted a homeland, and got it before the game even began. The blood elves wanted their sunwell back, and they got it too. Even the saintly draenei prioritized fixing their own ship. Why should the night elves be expected to be above this and vilified for pursuing self-interest that harms no one? Why are they held to a higher standard than everybody else? It's not like them being immortal hurts anyone. They were immortal for thousands of years already and they didn't overpopulate the world anymore than Tolkien's elves did.

09/09/2013 05:29 PMPosted by Dierle

Why are they held to a higher standard than everybody else?

Because pretty much the entire world is jelly of the Night elves. For good reason.

What, being much, much longer-lived then nearly every other playable race isn't good enough?

The world we have today, our standards of living, at least if you're a reasonably well off American, would be considered "good enough" by almost anyone in any society in history, yet we continue trying to improve Veloran. Do you condemn us for that as well?

Adding to Dierle's comment, Blizzard also shoehorned this idea of random Dorian-Grey-aging on certain Night Elves. I guess they didn't pray enough.

Regardless, I wish that at some point we could close the book on immortality. We're at Pirates of the Caribbean 4 levels of contrivances in explaining the latest scheme to regain immortality and why it ultimately can't happen. The Night Elves have more important matters to concern themselves with.

Adding to Dierle's comment, Blizzard also shoehorned this idea of random Dorian-Grey-aging on certain Night Elves. I guess they didn't pray enough.

Regardless, I wish that at some point we could close the book on immortality. We're at Pirates of the Caribbean 4 levels of contrivances in explaining the latest scheme to regain immortality and why it ultimately can't happen. The Night Elves have more important matters to concern themselves with.

Like why there is a lack of Wisps who self farm lumber. Why is Tyrande not pregnant yet.

Why is Tyrande not pregnant yet.

Would the kid come out with antlers and feathers? That'd be pretty odd.

I would figure that if people didn't have something to add, then they shouldn't post, but oh well.

I guess I'll respond to one point though:

Like why there is a lack of Wisps who self farm lumber.

Please provide your source demonstrating the lack.