World of Warcraft®

((Enjoy! :) ))

Everyone knows what a villain is. Right? We are evil. We are scum-of-the-earth madmen trying to take over the world. We like stealing candy from babies and murdering innocent seal pups.

More seriously, though, we are the scapegoats for many plots and events. Playing the antagonist and keeping it fun for both sides is a skill and an art. So first I reveal to you our most important dogma:

Communication, communication, communication!

While IC-OOC separation is the ideal, every RPer, whether good or bad, has taken comments and actions made ICly as personal OOC insults on occasion. It's the nature of the beast, but it must be avoided. One of the best ways of doing this is to keep an open OOC dialogue during the course of events.

What does this mean?

1) ASK before you do something that potentially has the power to alter a character's life forever. This can be things like torture, death, maiming, kidnapping, imprisonment, or any trials that change a character both physically or mentally for the long term. It's simply polite, and also helps forestall OOC drama further down the road.

2) TELL if you are being placed in a situation you don't want to be placed in. While the other person should be doing the above, it ultimately falls on you to be clear about what you want and don't want. If something in the RP is bothering you, don't let things fester. Speak up! A problem can't be fixed if the other side doesn't know it exists.

3) LISTEN to your RP buddies, and realize we can't always win. It takes two to tango, and without some cooperation, there is no RP. In fact, as villain, you're often expected to take the punishment dished out to you. This doesn't mean you have to lose every time someone thumbs their nose in your general direction, but it also leads right into my next point.

Villains are not respected for being badass. Villains are respected for losing in the most badass way possible.

This is also what I call "the Villain Expectation". Not only are you expected to be evil and nasty and perhaps a little insane, you're also expected to take a beating. Otherwise you're acting like a hero who doesn't act heroically at all, but expects to be treated as if they were. See where the problem lies?

As a villain, you're a loser. You're the antagonist that dies at the end of the story, and everyone lives happily ever after without you. This is a hard pill to swallow for many, because who likes being the jerk no one wants to be around? This is the cold, harsh reality for anyone playing a character who classifies as evil.

The key is to remember this is all about fun, not about who's the biggest guy on campus. As a villain, your role is all about sacrifice. You are taking the ultimate blow so that others may shine.

Keep the fun in it. When you lose, lose hilariously. When you win, win so that others may lose hilariously.

Finally, respect.

IC respect comes from OOC respect. Being a villain takes what they call "willing suspension of disbelief". Let's face it. Most villains are pretty extraordinary, unrealistic even. Their character concepts are hard to wrap heads around, and in the real world, would probably be laughed out of Stock.

In order for people to want to believe in your villain's backstory, you have to prove to them you're worthy of their time. You have to show them that your villain, while a jerk and a tad unbelievable, is a fun character to include in any plot. (This is also the basis behind playing characters who push the limits of the lore, if you were wondering!)

It's also about the give and take of power. There is nothing in your text or your game that makes it possible for you to really control people. If people are not willing to bend a little to your proclamation of power, then you have nothing but a spitting contest--no epic good vs. evil battle at all. People are more likely to bend to you when you bend to them.

And when all is said and done...

Playing a villain is draining. Everyone hates you, everyone is trying to make your royal plans fail. And what's worse, you have to let them!

Being a good villain is also remembering to take a break once in a while. Not only do you give your batteries a much-needed recharge, you also get to experience what it's like for the other side. This in turn can make you even better at playing your game the next time you take your villain character out for a cruise!

All in all, being a good villain means being OOCly flexible, humble, and with a good dash of creativity. It takes practice and a lot of elbow grease, but I think you will agree the epic stories that come out of this kind of RP are well worth the effort!

Excellent post. It's much harder being a good villain than it is a good hero. We used to have some tremendous villains. Dreejin comes to mind. That troll made my life miserable for a very long time.

I wish we had more good villains.

We have a few good villains on our server, but it's true we need more.... and I know there's some in the works. I'm hoping this guide will help us produce even MORE great villains though. Great work Yotingo!

We often wonder if we are villainousss, yesss. Sssometimesss we are, sssometimesss we are not, yesss.

(Abominus, I lost the chatlog, unfortunately, but I recreated the scene on the island in Booty Bay on page four in the Going Home thread. I hope I did you justice there.)

I think something should be added to this. While a player certainly needs to know his place as the eventual loser as a villain, I think it is also the responsibility of those opposing the villain to create a good story to while RPing with them. In other words, “How to effectively defeat a villain”.

It’s been my experience that two things generally happen when a player playing the hero goes after the villain. First, IC and OOC get confused. The villainous character is doing some god awful things, saying some horrid, demented and/or abusive words, doing things that well, aren’t nice, and the hero starts taking the hate of it and placing it upon the player. While a player playing the villain should be sensitive to people’s reactions, it should be up to the hero’s player to be able to separate the character from the person who created that character. We get all riled up sometimes watching a movie where a woman gets abused, a prisoner gets tortured or an innocent child gets murdered, but we do not hate the screenwriter or the actor for being involved in creating such a scene or villain. Heath Ledger was not really the Joker.

Second thing I’ve seen heroes try to do is they try to kill off the villain way too soon. They don’t give the villain a chance to develop as a character. They get this mentality, OMG its bad! Must kill it now! I’ve seen this happen a lot. Certain villains can and should last a long time. Be allowed to escape to try another day. Some real life villains have done their dirty deeds for years before getting caught. Bank robbers, serial killers, tyrannical despots, etc. Sometimes they’re known as the criminal but they get away with it simply because it’s hard to catch them.

Good points, Redearth.

I'd like to add something else. I'm not really sure the villain always has to lose. Dreejin kept up his nefarious ways for a long time. He may get thwarted here and there, but he scrambled back to his lair, licked his wounds and went back to plotting his next action.

The biggest problem with being a villain is people do lose sight of the ooc and ic lines and no one wants to play a game to have people start harassing you as soon as you log in.

There's a reason I play Gen as a general screw up. All powerful heroes are boring, one-dimensional characters. Gen wins occasionally, but not always and if she does it's usually not a pretty win.

So it is with good villains. They should be multidimensional. They should have redeeming qualities as well as an evil side.

Temperius is a good example of this. On the exterior, he's just a good businessman. He takes Gen on picnics and tailors things for Faithe. Look a little closer and he's pretty evil, but you have to dig to find that aspect.

When I think of the great villains of the servers past i think of RP plots. The diabolical plots of Creator stands out as an early example. These plots were motivation for great RP-PvP battles and forum stories that went on for months. I like what has been brought out in this post. I would add that the villain-plot aspect should be considered.

Back when I did a more-than-negligible amount of RPing, I played the villain all the time, because every good story needs a good villain. Perhaps I should get back into that some time...

"A hero is only as good as the evil he fights"

Just remember that, aspiring villains. You're going to face some grey quality good, and you're going to face some orange quality good. You're goal is to get more purps and oranges.

Thanks for the post, Yotingo.

Life has gotten a little busier recently, but I'm definitely still interested in being nefarious and helping come up with plots! Please contact me, IC or OOC.

I'd like to believe I did quite well with the villain role, at least according to those that participated in my "rise and fall". While still managing to stick to what people deemed acceptable to happen, According to my "victims" I had actually really freaked some of them out with the mind games I played before the final showdown and gettign a sword thrust down my throat. >_>


Excellent Guide by the way.

Gentyl, we sssaw your possst, and were amusssed, yesss.

Abominus, yes, speaking of villains...you should have visitors one day soon.

(( See, a lot of this thread is a part of the problem, with villains in WoW.

Everyone wants to be the hero, and therefore win. They expect the villain to be the "eventual loser", because there's no real way for a villain to make an effect on the world, whereas heroes constantly are via quests. The only real way for a villain to make a last effect on the world and RP community is to kill someone, or something.

Unfortunately, nobody really wants any of their significant characters to die, villains included.

So the heroes expect the villains to lose, by not killing anyone, and the villains want to make a lasting effect while the heroes don't want to "lose" by dying.

A villain who is just eventually going to lose is a boring, over-used, two dimensional villain. Of course, everyone dying isn't fun for them.

So, what you need, is grey areas and pyrrhic victories.

If nobody wants to lose, make it so nobody wins. The villain - whose main sin is vanity - gets done with his evil plot, but in the process is horribly scarred to the point of scaring women and children just with his appearance. Or, the heroes win, but in the process are scarred themselves, one way or another.

Another thing to keep in mind is that villains who just want to kick babies and take names, while possible to do well, are often not. Once again, grey areas are your friend. Heroes aren't always heroic. Villains aren't always villainous, and when they are, it's generally for a reason, twisted as it may be. "Just because" or "Because they're evil" is generally a poor choice, and a white knight in shining armor who never even thinks of succumbing to temptation is equally so.

Once again, having the villain be the eventual loser, is boring. Though having the villain get away scot-free, is also incredibly boring. We run into a lot of both, and they're both things to be avoided, and not just something that the villainous players need to work on. Try making it so that the heroes need the villain, for some reason or another, if you can't work out a grey area or pyrrhic victory scenario. Winning or losing on occasion isn't bad, but is so overdone it's nice to mix it up.

But, in general, villains in WoW are hard to do. They aren't necessary, but can be fun to do, if done right. If not, well, they can be more annoying than a poorly done "casual" or "hero" character, due to the nature of villainy.

Edit: this largely applies to players playing a villain. NPC villains are a bit different, and I won't go into that, but.

Edit 2: Another thing to keep in mind about 'losing' on a villain, or a hero. Nobody likes playing a broken, jaded character that is nothing like the one they had originally intended, which is what some plots seem to aim to do. The simple answer to this is; don't. Characters can take loss without completely changing. A bit of development, while keeping the general feel of the character, unless it's something you as the player want.

))

A villain, a REALLY good villain can making a lasting impact without killing anyone.

It may not be a victory but if you have done something to scar, mostly mentally, the heroes. Create a paranoia, destroy a relationship.... as Jafar says in Return of Jafar, "You'd be surprised what you can live through."

As someone who was sometimes lumped into the role of "Villain" (card carrying Modas and such), I'd seen various kinds of villainy. Some of the names may not ring a bell because it's been a while, but here's what I recall:

Aziel was the "Mastermind" kind of Villain. He had a group of like-minded individuals (or those who signed up for the benefits) and strove to acquire the attention and influence of The Old Gods through ancient artifacts. He had decadent tastes, often saw others as pawns, and would ultimately put his resources towards goals that would benefit him. One of his frequent sayings was Do What Thou Wilt.

Thelinna was the "Consort" kind of Villain. She would help others in the guild because it is what Aziel wanted. She would also have her goals and inner politics, but would usually defer to Aziel if there was a conflict of interests. She was sometimes the voice of the guild when dealing with Aziel directly was problematic.

Dreejin was the "Hedonist" kind of Villain. He wanted what he wanted, and the guild helped him get them. Drink, drugs, women, and so on. If he pulled his weight and made his sacrifices to the Loa, they helped him get what he wanted. He often got along with his guildmates until they got in the way of him getting what he wanted.

Sadera was the "High Priestess" kind of Villain. She worshipped The Triad, a group of three deities whose names I don't recall any more. Their ultimate goal was to destroy the world and have it be reborn. She worked to advance her faith, even if it conflicted with the group's goals. She would often work to discuss and convince people to help her, but often just came along for the mutual benefit.

Doctor Wolfe was the "Mad Scientist" kind of Villain. He created monstrosities and mayhem because he needed to. His brain was full of ideas that needed to be built, even if it meant destruction of just-short-of-everything. Progress At All Costs. Aziel knew he was a high risk asset, but could see past his eccentricities and frequent organ donors because he got results.

Bear in mind, these are just off-the-cuff summaries and I'm glossing over a lot of stuff. With these in mind, I often felt we were persued because we were one of the only (sometimes THE only) nemeses on the Horde that were frequently targeted. Sometimes we'd be asked if we could be the ones who killed someone's parents for a backstory. Other times people would try to say they attacked us because "you're bound to be guilty of something". I do recall a few times when IC and OOC got blurred, and it was the off-and-on drama that caused some of the Modas to be on alts or not play much at all. I'm not sure if Doctor Wolfe is "evil" or if he just doesn't care about society. he has a large laboratory, a production facility, and a nearly limitless budget. Why would he care about what other people thought of him?

Again, I'm open to feedback and conversation. As a side note, I don't see Abominus as evil, either. Just chaotic. It may be one of the reasons he and Vincent get along as well as they do.

Dr. Wolfe,

That's a really good summary.

I had a running battle with Dreejin for years. I can only think of one time he actually "lost" and that's when his assassination attempt on Tery backfired and Dree wound up getting planted.

It was never about winning and losing, though we all thought we were playing to win. It was the continuing stories.

Modas really was the ultimate source of awesome villainy. I sort of miss the old Modas. We should stir up some trouble.

As I said before, multi-dimensional chars, good or evil, are always much more interesting. That goes to end results also. The good guys don't always win and the bad guys don't always lose.

Modas seemed to spawn a lot of really well-developed, interesting characters.

I don't see Abominus as evil either, per se. He's chaos dark I suppose as opposed to Gen's chaos light.

A villain doesn't need to be evil, per se, nor do they need to be the villain 100% of the time. It's all dependent on the goals of the other characters. Sometimes it's not evil that's bad, sometimes it's chaos. Or sometimes it's extreme points of view, that may be entirely good.

Cray, for instance, has the makings of a villain in that he is very angry and has really extreme points of view. The fact that he has Gentyl and Taelanas to tone him down and reel him in is probably the main thing that hasn't led him down the path of being an occasional villain -- but that's not to say it couldn't happen at some point. (It probably won't though.... :P)
If that were to happen, it would have utterly different dynamics than most villains since Cray is (I think?) generally respected if not always liked as someone with the best of intentions.

Similarly -- and I'm not saying this would ever happen but it *could* and it would not be unrealistic -- even though Gentyl's chaos is purely unintentional, it's feasible that there could at some point be such a breakdown of order due to something revolving around Gentyl that she might be an unknowing or unintentional villain of the peace.
Again, this would have totally different dynamics than most villains since anyone who knows Gentyl knows that the chaos that surrounds her is completely unintentional. She's also renown for being a champion of the Light, which would make her a very a-typical bad guy.