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I don't know, Prian.

Yes, there is a great amount of useful lore information in this here thread. But as I understand it, every society is going to have individuals/groups whose lifestyle or evolved philosophy is going to cause a break with societal norms. Yes, the vast majority of the nameless collective is going to be easily summarized by historical events and the categorization of their order/group/caste, but to say that certain Kaldorei cannot be "humanized" or "secularized" is really unaccomodating to RPers who want to a play an elf off the beaten track.

I will agree that a big slice of Kaldorei rp is "blue human" malarkey, but that is just the nature of the beast when it comes to Warcraft rp. Every race is subject to it- Just look at how many ditzy/cute female Draenei there are, or how many trolls fulfill the "goofy elf-loving free spirit" stereotype. Obviously it's very easy to discriminate against a secularized Kaldorei character because of their superficial resemblance to bad elf RPers, but I think the lore-keen players of this server are much too quick to hop on the lol-leet train when they don't definitively see other players flawlessly fulfilling a lore-based stereotype.

Is it really hard to picture a Kaldorei being assimilated, more or less, into another races' culture? I understand that hundreds of years in a single culture is a tough nut to crack, but I don't think it's such a big stretch to expect to see Kaldorei whose entire character breaks with tradition. I've argued this point a few times, using my own elf as a template- and you wouldn't believe how people take lore and use it to pigeonhole things. What in Kaldorei lore says that an elf cannot be overweight/obese? Why is it impossible for a lore-appropriate Kaldorei to affect a speech pattern more appropriate to a goblin or a human?

The problem i see is that many people treat lore as an "all or nothing" thing. I'm not saying that's what the OP is suggesting at all, but I really do think that people need to allow for a certain freedom in other peoples' character concepts. Things would get incredibly boring very quickly if everything was 100% lore-based/appropriate.

I didn't quite feel like checking all seven pages to see if somebody else corrected you, but Night Elves -do- take up their mate's surname when they 'marry'.

I cite the alchemist trainer in Dolanaar and his wife. She even refers to him as her husband when asking herbalist players a favor.

While it is true they're mentioned to be husband/wife, also consider that there are multiple cases of Night Elves not taking each other's names. The most obvious being Malfurion and Tyrande but there are other examples in lore, examples that are just as relevant as the two elves you mentioned.

Also consider that Kaldorei surnames may be widespread. It could be possible that these two had the same last name and were either unrelated or distantly related.

And lastly, when we get into the sticky possibility of taking surnames we get into the issue of who's surname is taken. Remember that Kaldorei gender roles are somewhat reversed compared to human gender roles. Logically, that'd mean that the men take the female's last name.

I didn't quite feel like checking all seven pages to see if somebody else corrected you, but Night Elves -do- take up their mate's surname when they 'marry'.

I cite the alchemist trainer in Dolanaar and his wife. She even refers to him as her husband when asking herbalist players a favor.

While it is true they're mentioned to be husband/wife, also consider that there are multiple cases of Night Elves not taking each other's names. The most obvious being Malfurion and Tyrande but there are other examples in lore, examples that are just as relevant as the two elves you mentioned.

Also consider that Kaldorei surnames may be widespread. It could be possible that these two had the same last name and were either unrelated or distantly related.

And lastly, when we get into the sticky possibility of taking surnames we get into the issue of who's surname is taken. Remember that Kaldorei gender roles are somewhat reversed compared to human gender roles. Logically, that'd mean that the men take the female's last name.

Plzzzzzz don't take this the wrong way, but..

Do you think that perhaps you're reading way too much into this idea of arbitrary lore?
I'm having a hard time imagining this scene at Blizz HQ:

Content writer/dev: Guys, we have two weeks to submit a preliminary draft of all quests and content in teldrassil. Enough for 1-14, no exceptions.
Metzen: here's the lore, lol
Writer/dev: Right! We're going to start by spending the next two hours hashing out the lore of elf matrimonial conventions, because we sure want to make sure all of these throwaway quests and characters adhere perfectly to lore!

There are reasons why there are elves with titles, elves with no last name, draeneis with last names, etc. Etc. The revs did not spend the ludicrous time it would take to make 100% lore approved content. Nearly none of the millions of people who play wow care about about insipid things lik Kaldorei surname conventions.

This is exactly the ridiculous adherence to lore I roll my eyes at.

Misquote in above post, but no edit function >:(

Is it really hard to picture a Kaldorei being assimilated, more or less, into another races' culture?

Considering their xenophobia? Yes, it would be hard for the Kaldorei to be assimilated into another culture with only 10 years of exposure.

I understand that hundreds of years in a single culture is a tough nut to crack, but I don't think it's such a big stretch to expect to see Kaldorei whose entire character breaks with tradition.

I'm writing a guide about traditional Kaldorei because that is the most distinct. Breaking tradition is always a social taboo. Progressive Night Elves exist but they would be far and few in between because of how the Night Elves have lived for the past ten thousand years.

What in Kaldorei lore says that an elf cannot be overweight/obese?

This is why I gave an average weight for each gender, not a definitive answer. To say "Males have an average weight of XYZ" means just that, an average male would weight that amount. An overweight Night Elf would not be average.

The average weight is also to act as a guideline. 250 pounds is not 'overweight' for a male Night Elf, though some may consider it to be as 250 pounds -is- overweight for a human.

Why is it impossible for a lore-appropriate Kaldorei to affect a speech pattern more appropriate to a goblin or a human?

Night Elves speak common so they -do- have a speech pattern appropriate to a human. However you also need to apply common sense to this. We are approaching 10 years after Night Elves first came into contact with humans. General xenophobia would mean that the majority of their population would not have close contact with other races for a few years after that.

This would mean, likely, that Night Elves have only had real, true contact for only seven or eight years. Considering how long it takes to learn a language, it's unlikely a Kaldorei would speak flawless common. Look at the real world, where people leave their country to live in America and 10 years later they still have an accent.

Do you think that perhaps you're reading way too much into this idea of arbitrary lore?

Most RP guides have to read into arbitrary lore. Without it you're left with a very bare, very hole ridden idea of what a race is about. Quests, books, the RTSs and the RPGs are all sources for a guide, with constant overriding and rewriting.

The purpose of this guide is to give an idea of where Night Elves come from and how their culture and traditions work. It has to rely on what I can gleem from what sources I have access to.

I will totally get back to this when I can sit at an actual computer. We're gonna go.

I don't recall reading this. Night Elves are very sociable amongst their own kind and allies such as Dryads, Keepers, and furbolgs.

Interesting factoid: Untainted/uncorrupted Dryads are unable to feel sadness.

And a quick bump to keep this on the front page.

Night Elf Quick Question

Were the humans aware of night elves before or after Stormwind was created. For example, if you play "purple human" would it be possible to be born in Stormwind. Or is this out of the realm of possibility.

Night Elf Quick Question

Were the humans aware of night elves before or after Stormwind was created. For example, if you play "purple human" would it be possible to be born in Stormwind. Or is this out of the realm of possibility.

Night Elves were undiscovered until 10 years ago. The only elves humans were aware of up until the exodus to Kalimdor were the High Elves (now renamed Blood Elves).

So no, it'd be impossible for a Night Elf to be born in the Eastern Kingdoms and be older than, say, 8 years of age.

Night Elf Quick Question

Were the humans aware of night elves before or after Stormwind was created. For example, if you play "purple human" would it be possible to be born in Stormwind. Or is this out of the realm of possibility.

Purple humans make me cringe. >.<

And god forbid people do it on purpose. :(

I could have sworn the Guardians of Tirisfal knew of the Night Elves, at least to the point that they knew they existed, but not to the extent of being able to create viable, RP-able Kaldorei half breeds.

The only elves humans were aware of up until the exodus to Kalimdor were the High Elves (now renamed Blood Elves).

Blood Elves and High Elves are biologically and politically distinct. It's not -just- a name change.

Curious again

What are some examples of "Purple human". Cause I might be accidently rp-ing like one, considering I can't even see the difference. Is it the way they talk? Or is it just your origins that make you one.

I just assume my character has been influenced by humans since all his guild brothers and closest combat allies are literally all humans.

"Purple human" I believe refers to half breed night elf humans, or simply human cultured kaldorei. I haven't heard the term outside of a few posts here on the Moon Guard forums.

The only elves humans were aware of up until the exodus to Kalimdor were the High Elves (now renamed Blood Elves).

Blood Elves and High Elves are biologically and politically distinct. It's not -just- a name change.

Yes, but the High Elves became the Blood Elves for the most part. That was the point, while the kingdom was Stormwind was around (and not burned down by Orcs) all Blood Elves now were High Elves then.

Curious again

What are some examples of "Purple human". Cause I might be accidently rp-ing like one, considering I can't even see the difference. Is it the way they talk? Or is it just your origins that make you one.

I just assume my character has been influenced by humans since all his guild brothers and closest combat allies are literally all humans.

"Purple human" is an OOC term for people who roleplay Night Elves like humans.

Edit: Which is a 'nono'

Hmmm, very well I will try my best then to avoid "Purple Humaning", I should look for a night elf rp coach.

Also, they got some good phrases here on their official site.

http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/encyclopedia/361.xml

Anymore like this?

"Purple human" is an OOC term for people who roleplay Night Elves like humans.

Edit: Which is a 'nono'

No-no doesn't begin to describe it. If you're a night elf and you're still RPing in Stormwind, even now that the park is -gone-, you would have to deal with humans, human smells, the visitors to the city of other races (and smells thereof), the violence, lack of significant plant life, polluted waters, smell of magic, taste of magic, buzz of magic in the air...
Basically, you'd have to be significantly different from the Night elves as a whole to be a night elf staying in Stormwind of their own free will. And, as mentioned before, Night elves don't do 'different' so well.

Lorewise, anyway.
No problem at all to stop being a purple human, though! Simply go back to Darnassus and claim your mind was muddled by the human magics, so you didn't have the presence of mind to come back.