World of Warcraft®

03/18/2014 11:26 AMPosted by Aurric

It was the Legacy of Leyara quest chain that made me give up on Malfurion as a character ... I just don't care what happens to him anymore. It doesn't matter to me.

I was fine with that. He's not going to brood over something that someone else chose to do in reaction to what he was doing (or not doing). Malfurion doesn't take that kind of crap from anyone.

Which is why he's unfit to be leader.

His "guidance" has created the quasi Highborn 2.0 we have now with druids

03/18/2014 06:27 PMPosted by Seiryu

03/18/2014 11:26 AMPosted by Aurric

It was the Legacy of Leyara quest chain that made me give up on Malfurion as a character ... I just don't care what happens to him anymore. It doesn't matter to me.

I was fine with that. He's not going to brood over something that someone else chose to do in reaction to what he was doing (or not doing). Malfurion doesn't take that kind of crap from anyone.

From a Horde perspective, I could see where you would come up with that, but these are his people, and they are suffering due to the forces diverted to Hyjal. This is an issue that should have deserved more play on both sides, rather than just "I'm right, they're wrong" coming from the one

03/18/2014 06:27 PMPosted by Seiryu

I was fine with that.

So hypothetically here would you be fine if you lost family members to an attack on your people by an enemy people and then one of the leaders of your people told you it didn't matter? That it wasn't important?

The Leyara chain was the perfect example of why Malfurion has no right to lead his people. He should have been made full blown neutral instead of juggled back and forth between Alliance leader and "lets be friends to save the world" CC hippy.

His behavior is disgusting.

That's why he is so hated.

03/18/2014 10:04 AMPosted by Relesa

I think this can be benefited by noting as far as D&D alignments go:

Tyrande: Neutral Good

Malfurion: Neutral Neutral (True Neutral)

As far as the motivators for the why each does a thing, well, I'm not certain that's been anything past lightly hinted at. One was a great leader, the other is more animal than Night Elf, and is apparently slowly forgetting to think. Both are under the writers' pens, keyboards, etc; the issue is, great writing takes consideration.

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Malfurion is too selfish and too distant to be True Neutral. He preaches about maintaining the balance without understanding the Balance.

Maintaining a True Neutral alignment actually take a lot of proactive work, not sitting around and not being involved. Its a common mistake for D&D noobs.A True Netural Druid will just as soon let a new village develop in the wilderness as cull/wipe one out because it was too big/causing too much deforestation.

Even more galling is that these issues of Malfurion not caring are easy to deal with. First, move him out of Tyrande's throne room (or whatever) in Darn. These are two power political players and it is easy to believe that each is VERY busy. Further, if I were going to target one powerful person, Tyrande, I would use spies and intelligence, in lore, to make sure her Archdruid husband is nowhere near her when I attack. This can be shown in game by him not being in that room.

As for his lack of action regarding Ashenvale, let's break down what is happening. The Night Elves are fighting numerically superior forces on three fronts-Azshara, Ashenvale and Hyjal. This makes it easy to believe that the Night Elves are having trouble. Have Malfurion, one, be the reason along with the PC that the Horde is routed and, two, behave in manner similary to a large predator; ie defend his territory but not attack the Horde on its own territory. The reason is simple, as a Druid he simply will not create or cause an extinction event. Make it part of the Druid code of conduct or something.

03/18/2014 06:39 PMPosted by Anyaceltica

Malfurion is too selfish and too distant to be True Neutral.

True Neutral is all about being selfish and distant. Everything a True Neutral person does is beyond the understanding of more reasonable people who would pick a side and stick with it. Everything a True Neutral person does is based on their own perceptions of the world around them without regard to how the world sees the same thing.

Hence this thread.

03/18/2014 06:42 PMPosted by Seiryu

03/18/2014 06:39 PMPosted by Anyaceltica

Malfurion is too selfish and too distant to be True Neutral.

True Neutral is all about being selfish and distant. Everything a True Neutral person does is beyond the understanding of more reasonable people who would pick a side and stick with it. Everything a True Neutral person does is based on their own perceptions of the world around them without regard to how the world sees the same thing.

Hence this thread.

Which is why Druids and some clerics have to follow tenets to force them to be involved in a story or game. Mafurion doesn't or plays lip service.

This is why a bare minimum neutral 'shoot at the hip' leader is a horrible leader. Malfurion is large part of the Night Elf Problem.

He'd make an excellent raid boss though

03/18/2014 07:21 PMPosted by Grortraugh

He'd make an excellent raid boss though

What are you talking about? He'd stand there like he does now.

I just noticed that Leyara is the Night elven Garithos.

I recall a suggestion from a long time ago about this issue. The poster essentially said that Malfurion should be made to patrol Darnassus, and totally wipe any raid that happens to agro him.

Or they could put him in Fandral's old spot... That at least makes more sense than having him stand there, sipping on a slurpee.

A lot of the hate for Malfurion stems back to Warcraft III, primarily because of Illidan, who was such a beloved and popular character.

Let's see. One brother was portrayed as wise, intelligent, sensible and perhaps a little aloof.
The other was the rebel. Conflicted, passionate, powerful and with an addictive personality (but rather than drugs or sex like modern day rebels, Illidan's addiction was magic).

Whose story are more people generally going to be interested in? The rebel's of course. It's the same in almost any story.

Illidan was always going to be the far more popular of the two Stormrage brothers...so how receptive were people ever going to be to the less popular brother being brought back (Cataclysm) after the more loved one was killed off (in Burning Crusade)?

Malfurion never really stood much chance. The stupid game mechanics surrounding him (being put next to Tyrande but doing nothing when she is attacked) just worsened the situation.

Blizzard definitely need to do something with Malfurion. He was used very poorly even in his big return expansion (Cataclysm) and has done bugger all since then.

One option could be for him to realise his own mistakes with his people, step down as a Night Elf leader and give Tyrande sole leadership (which would also allow for her character to grow and become more involved in events).

Then have Malfurion focus his efforts on something else....maybe the Cenarion Circle and preparing for the coming battles against the Legion and the Old Gods (both whom Malfurion has history with).

03/18/2014 10:25 PMPosted by Kalorea

This is a hurtful thing to say.

I have aspergers but that doesn't mean im completely uncaring and inconsiderate. :/

Now I feel like a jerk. :( Sorry, I won't make jokes about stuff like that again. I wasn't really thinking through that post and how people with it would actually take from it.

03/18/2014 06:31 PMPosted by Ferliona

His "guidance" has created the quasi Highborn 2.0 we have now with druids

It's sort of ironic- the very caste who the druids banished for thousands of years.. are now doing all they can and MORE to help their own people than the druids are.

It certainly makes for interesting roleplay!

03/19/2014 08:46 AMPosted by Madelynn

03/18/2014 06:31 PMPosted by Ferliona

His "guidance" has created the quasi Highborn 2.0 we have now with druids

It's sort of ironic- the very caste who the druids banished for thousands of years.. are now doing all they can and MORE to help their own people than the druids are.

It certainly makes for interesting roleplay!

That's probably what bugs me the most....

Externally, to the players, the mistreatment of Night Elves has opened up some pretty awesome and massive plot hooks.... But in universe and in character, no mention is made of them, so you know it's not intentional.

I mean, even Tyrande can be fixed and explained away if you use the "She's losing faith in herself, and it's hurting everything she does" line, and explain the reason she's losing faith is because her very own husband has been responsible for the rise of a new populace of Night Elves who are, in spirit, very much like the old Highborn.

It would be even better of those very same Druids held much respect for Tyrande, as it would drive home the point even better. Tyrande already fears becoming like Azshara, so it's a pretty damned good direction to use that fear, even if unfounded, to weaken and change the character for the better and move the story along.

I mean, the actions of ALP Tyrande make "perfect" sense when taken from the angle of "My people are losing themselves, my husband and his cult have distanced themselves from the people, caring so much more for their magic and knowledge than their peoples home, they covet immortality forthemselves, even if it's a limited version, and they are piece by piece undoing and reverting us back to a state more similar to Azshara's reign than my own.. I WILL NOT stand by and do nothing, I must rush, I must act, ect, ect, ect."

Tyrande losing faith in herself (which also fixes her Dues Ex problem she's got going on with Elune) based off of the unraveling of Kaldorei Culture thanks to Malfurion and his teachings, which increasingly (to the outside) resemble the old Highborn caste (which fits, as his original students were Moonguard), the love of her life... And as Malfruion's mate, she would get more respect from the Druids... Further driving in the point of Azshara similarities to a mind already doubting.... After all, Azshara was the only one the Highborn liked.

Here's my argument as to why I don't like Malfurion Stormrage. He sleeps for 3k years (+/-) and is then called the greatest druid, even though tauren have been druids longer. He's suddenly a leader even though he's been out of the loop. He turns into a tree (Not his fault), but then goes to trick a girl into chopping him down so he can be free and "Save the world" (aka, direct someone else to save the world). All this is going on, and there are other druids more qualified than him to lead and guide. Being the first, doesn't make you the best. Hamuul's been a druid for, I don't even know long, and he can swipe in a 40 yard range. Malfurion castes Moon Fire a dozen times, and ticks less dps than my ret pally. See the problem? Hamuul 4 Cenarion Circle.

03/18/2014 06:27 PMPosted by Seiryu

Malfurion doesn't take that kind of crap from anyone.

please tell me this is misworded and youre not justifying a head of state purposely ignoring his people being invaded by a foreign nation in favour of solely his own followers and their ethics

please