World of Warcraft®

04/04/2014 12:02 PMPosted by Ninja

Has it ever occurred to anyone that maybe Blizzard purposely wrote Malfurion's character/plot that way? Like maybe they have some future plans for him and they want you to be frustrated with his current position?

It's always important to remember, authors and creators are often setting things up far in advance.

If no one is questioning him or criticizing his current attitude towards the night elves in the story, then I doubt that they are intentionally writing him as a frustrating character. I don't think anyone expresses opinions inside night elf society though. You just have Malfurion and Tyrande as basically the only ones that do anything, and Tyrande's opinions seem to just be Malfurion's since he returned. It's bad writing to just have someone being a horrible character while no one says anything against him, and then turn around one day and say "oh wait, people didn't like him", it's just lazy.

04/04/2014 12:02 PMPosted by Ninja

Has it ever occurred to anyone that maybe Blizzard purposely wrote Malfurion's character/plot that way? Like maybe they have some future plans for him and they want you to be frustrated with his current position?

It's always important to remember, authors and creators are often setting things up far in advance.

He and Tyrande are Alliance faction leaders. So no, they don't have any future plans for them unless their child marries into the Hellscream clan.

04/04/2014 11:36 AMPosted by Amandalynn

You're right. He shouldn't be removed because of a vocal bunch. He should be removed because he's a ridiculous looking anthropomorphic chicken-man whose presence undercuts one of what used to be one of the few strong female characters in the game. She was leading the Night Elves just fine for thousands of years until Winnie the Pooh woke up from his nap.

And if you bothered to read anything, she wants him to lead with her, and he can't say no.

whether he wants to or not.

I get that people want to be a successful character, but she doesn't have to be a "I don't need no man" hater like many seem to imply.

She can have her Malfurion, and be good character too. Blizzard just has to make it happen.

04/03/2014 11:43 AMPosted by Nethaera

For this reason, if a goblin offers to sell you a "historical artifact," you'd better pass. They've been scamming unsuspecting archaeologists with scrap metal and banana slicers for years.

It'd be awesome if they put a vendor in like this! Especially once the toybox comes out, so these types of things didn't take up bagspace. It reminds me of Griftah, and I totally woulda bought all his necklaces if I wasn't so limited in my bags haha.

04/03/2014 12:50 PMPosted by Lena

Harbinger Vurenn is not affiliated with the Hand of Argus. In fact, having "official" ties to the order would be a hindrance for his area of expertise. Vurenn remains an extremely well-connected draenei whose contacts include vindicators (such as Yaala) of that very organization.

I'm not really sure what the importance of this is.

I'm wondering the same thing...What a random question. Is it because he's possibly the only other Paladin that we've encountered besides Maraad? Is it because he's not titled as a Vindicator? I feel like I'm missing something.

The fact of the Worgen matter is, Worgen form is considered their TRUE FORM. With the Human form being a shape shift spell only possible because of the worgen's druidic nature.

Any decent amount of stress cause their true nature to surface and their true form to surface.

Meaning, if you where to cast a spell that changes them to their true form they would be worgen.

If you to cast a spell that dispels illusions on a worgen in human form, they would turn worgen.

If you to kill them their bodies would be worgen.

So, unless the curse "changing them" completely (With only a potion and a ritual giving them back their human minds) has been retconed so that they are just humans with a (complicated) shape shift spell I would expect their to be puppy children.

It also means worgen aren't even a real race, just humans that look diferent : /

04/04/2014 07:36 AMPosted by Mazzlu

I don't think blood mixes too much during pregnancy. Otherwise wouldn't children typically have the same blood type as the mother? For example, my mother is A- and I'm O+

Doesn't look like it mixed much.

It doesn't mix during pregnancy, but it does during childbirth. Its called Rh Disease Rh Incompatibility. Without Modern medicine, you would likely die during childbirth if your blood is different from your mothers. Its one reason why people who pursue a 'natural birth' are tempting fate.

https://www.nhlbi.nih.gov/health/health-topics/topics/rh/

http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/797150-overview

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rh_disease

04/04/2014 01:58 PMPosted by Seebach

04/04/2014 11:36 AMPosted by Amandalynn

You're right. He shouldn't be removed because of a vocal bunch. He should be removed because he's a ridiculous looking anthropomorphic chicken-man whose presence undercuts one of what used to be one of the few strong female characters in the game. She was leading the Night Elves just fine for thousands of years until Winnie the Pooh woke up from his nap.

And if you bothered to read anything, she wants him to lead with her, and he can't say no.

whether he wants to or not.

I get that people want to be a successful character, but she doesn't have to be a "I don't need no man" hater like many seem to imply.

She can have her Malfurion, and be good character too. Blizzard just has to make it happen.

That's where things go downhill. I don't have anything against badass females having boyfriends, nor do I have anything against badass females who have boyfriends with important combat roles, but I do have something against females who have boyfriends with important roles AND interfere with their combat prowesses.

At that point in time, Tyrande ceases to be a badass anymore as the combat role has been subjected to the boyfriend and her "badass" character development goes down the toilet. If Blizzard can write Tyrande and Malfurion's story so that they can be wife and husband and still have badass roles to play in the war effort then that is fantastic.

The problem is they can't, therefore if they try to do so they will fail and the story will turn out much worse than before. They should keep their stories separate from each other, and still date on their off-hours, but not do them both simultaneously. That's just opening a whole new can of worms that no one wants to deal with, the same can of worms we're dealing with right now.

04/04/2014 05:00 PMPosted by Drede

The fact of the Worgen matter is, Worgen form is considered their TRUE FORM. With the Human form being a shape shift spell only possible because of the worgen's druidic nature.

Any decent amount of stress cause their true nature to surface and their true form to surface.

Meaning, if you where to cast a spell that changes them to their true form they would be worgen.

If you to cast a spell that dispels illusions on a worgen in human form, they would turn worgen.

If you to kill them their bodies would be worgen.

So, unless the curse "changing them" completely (With only a potion and a ritual giving them back their human minds) has been retconed so that they are just humans with a (complicated) shape shift spell I would expect their to be puppy children.

It also means worgen aren't even a real race, just humans that look diferent : /

I think when they say "true form" they mean "default form" not the actual true form (which would be human because they are born human). Getting plastic surgery doesn't rewrite your DNA to make your kids look like your new look.

I'm gonna go with the theory that after the calming ritual worgen bites wont turn people and that mixing/consuming of blood without a ritual setting wont spread the curse either.

I'm probably not as much of an expert as all of you guys on the lore matter so help me see this right.

Malfurion is seen as incompetent because he is mostly neutral? The way I see it is like this: In cataclysm, Malfurion saw Ragnaros and Deathwing as the bigger threat because no matter who 'won' between the Horde and Alliance, they would still end the world. In this, he chose to form a temporary alliance with some horde faction members in order to root out the evil that would've plagued them after the war.

Also, I don't think he's incompetent on the battlefield either considering he pushed back the burning legion twice and it was his idea to blow up the world tree to kill Archemond, thus saving all of Kalimdor from being engulfed by the scourge.

Consider him a PVE player. Many hardcore PVE players are care bears when it comes to the Alliance/Horde conflict because in many instances in PVE the main threat is not the Horde but the overlying enemy at the time and in many cases, the Alliance and Horde work together to overcome that. In this way, Malfurion has probably made many Horde friends that he wouldn't want to see hurt in a conflict between brothers that can be avoided.

Now the reason I believe Malfurion is a co-leader of the Night Elves comes from their beginnings as Trolls. At the dawn of the Troll race, the ones who eventually became elves did so probably when they came into contact with Elune. This adds two locus' of power. The Loa gods that the old Trolls worshiped and the holy light of Elune. Now that leaves out the Well of Eternity but that gets destroyed. This would mean that they would have to live in that sort of contrast between the two locus' of power seeing that following the light of Elune is not mutually exclusive to following the traditions of old. Think of it as a dual-religioned theocracy where neither religion holds sway over the other because the vast majority of followers follow both religions.

As for Tyrande being around Malfurion's arm at every turn, she spent 10,000 years of missing someone. They have catching up to do! Not to mention how busy they are running a kingdom in a multi-front war. They probably only have a few minutes each day to catch up on 10,000 years while making new memories in the process.

Now, for that part where she gets second guessed in the trial of patience. She sees the Orcs that slaughtered many of her people and she wants to rush towards vindication knowing that their leader is somewhere in those lands and the only way to truly end the Warsong conflict is to end the Horde. It is in her best interest to kill those whelps and find their Warchief ASAP. This is not Wrynn's goal. He wants to bide his time and save his soldiers for more conflicts to come which is why he asks her to wait. Think of it like the Alterac Valley BG. Many people want to rush to the end for quick conquest but others insist on taking bases first and back capping to secure the resource war even if it takes longer. This is because while taking our Garrosh ends the war on the Night Elves front as far as they're concerned, it doesn't end the war on the Eastern Kingdoms front with Sylvannis looming over.

Now, believe it or not, both Tyrande and Malfurion are well fleshed out characters and while the past few releases didn't have as much to do with them as other characters there's more to them than you would believe. Did you know that even though Illidain is called the 'Betrayer', Malfurion actually betrayed Illidain more times? Illidain was actually thinking of his people when he drew vials of the well of eternity and Malfurion probably created that misunderstanding in order to get Illidain out of the picture out of fear that Tyrande might view his brother as the better man. Why might Illidain be the better man? He's more compassionate than Malfurion! Before the sundering, Night Elves were second class citizens compared to the Highborn. After the destruction, Illidain sought to save his Highborn brothers from the catastrophic loss by taking some of the well water and making a new well to help them out. Another instance of Illidain's compassion is seen when he takes a curse upon himself in order to root out a Nathrazim and save his people. Malfurion then banishes his brother (probably to keep him and Tyrande separate). In doing so, he weakened his people greatly before the upcoming battle for the fate of Azeroth. Why? Because Illidain could've used the skull of Gul'dan to kill Archimonde without having to destroy the world tree and weakening the Night Elf race (and he would've sacrificed himself to do it if he had to). Despite joining the Legion, Illidain is a champion of all Elven kind be it the High, Blood, Naga, or Night Elves and Malfurion seeks to hide that in fear of losing Tyrande to the better man by keeping her in ignorance of it. Malfurion is an !@#$%^-, but a cunning one.

Tyrande is more compassionate than Malfurion, but she has her fair share of hot blood. While this puts her more on the PVPer side than it does Malfurion, she can still see where he's coming from when it comes to working together for a higher cause. This is ultimately what drove Staghelm off the deep end, but that's a whole other can of worms. But as weak as many people think she is, they forget she's also a cultural leader and her people are going through a huge transition taking in Worgen and Highborn and she, as the leader of the Night Elves is probably busy taking care of the politics behind that (Because Malfurion is probably not up to snuff on his politics after his long slumber). And this is why we don't see enough of her for people to consider her a strong character. Because she's taking care of all of the societal politics that we don't see (She's actually leading).

I'll cover Moira and Jaina in another post because this is already long.

Posted by Cirno
04/03/2014 11:43 AMPosted by Nethaera
The worgen curse is exactly that: a curse. Its origins are rooted in the druidic "pack form" that was later altered by the Scythe of Elune. The end result is the worgen we see today, beings that can transmit their affliction to others via a single bite.

In theory, if two worgen were to mate and produce an offspring, that offspring would not be a worgen. The child would merely possess the genetic material of his or her parents, like any other child sans the curse.

This seems really odd, given the fact that the curse can be transmitted by blood. A child in the womb would be changed, I would think.

I don't think mother and child actually share blood. Nutrients and oxygen are transported across the placental membrane but the blood itself doesn't mix.

not necessarily it would kind of be like STD's where if the baby is not born properly the infant can get the mothers STD. So in theory the baby could be born worgen.

Now covering Jaina and Moira:

Jaina: You can't be serious in saying that she's a weak character this expansion. She is the PARAGON of PVP. Yeah, she gets second guessed by everyone. Garrosh went genocidal on her kingdom and his Horde was using half of her other kingdom as well. In her mind, it was probably only a matter of time before another nuke was detonated in Dalaran so she had to follow Arthas' example and purge the evil before it festers. After seeing how far the Horde would go, she wouldn't dare risk it again. She pretty much helped found Orgrimmar when she helped Thrall defeat Proudmoore so imagine how betrayed she probably felt when her city and Rhonin was annihilated. Also imagine the pressure she probably felt to back the Alliance as Windrunner and Wrynn were breathing down her neck, yet she was strong enough to say no until she was taken advantage of again by someone she trusted.

Indiscriminately killing civilians is an easy thing to second guess, but so then was the culling of Stratholm as there were obviously going to be innocent people harmed but that's what Arthas had to do to avoid genocide and that's probably what Jaina was thinking at the time she was rampaging through the streets.

Another thing that's easily second guessable is the whole using a giant tidal wave to engulf Orgrimmar. You bet civilians would die! Bur in her eyes, that's what was probably needed to be done and would've saved more lives than trying to take the city with man power (maybe even more innocent lives). To me, the whole being able to wreck a city on a whim is a testament to power right there so she can't be considered a powerless person in that department. The only thing really stopping her was politics (and fear of becoming the next raid boss).

So how does she play her hand? She twists Wrynn's arm by telling him to end the Horde right there. Not because she can't kill Garrosh herself (because she can) but because she needs to take the politics out of his death or she puts her people in danger. Now, if she had the backing of Wrynn, she had the backing of the Alliance and it would be an easy win in that throne room and with all of the major leaders gone, it would be an easy win outside as well. But one thing really got in the way. Wrynn was once Lo'gash and he can understand the Horde's concept of honor which also allows him to respect them.That's probably what stopped him in that throne room.

Contrast this with the Jaina we knew from the old days. She was a foil to Thrall, Arthas, Kaelthas, and Wrynn. She never really acted on her own accord and constantly relied on others. She was the pinnacle of care bear. Remember when she did a whole lot of nothing for 3 expansions even though war was raging all around her? She didn't want the war but she also didn't work too hard on a solution either. Now THAT Jaina was a poor female characterization! Not the one who thinks for herself now.

Moira: Runs away from home to marry her Father's Arch Nemesis. Be it charm or whatever that's already an interesting twist. In this, she is made Queen of the Dark Irons and rightful heir to Blackrock and Ironforge. It's the political wedding of the century and for all we know, it may have been her idea all along. I don't think many people understand the kind of political power she wields. BRD was a 5 man assault on China! So when the King of Ironforge disappeared from the picture, did you think the Bronzebeards and Wildhammers were scared when Moira returned (with their mortal enemies) to claim the throne? To avoid a civil war that would weaken her country, Moira agreed to the council of 3 hammers in order to eventually groom her son into a Dwarven Emporer. All the meanwhile, the Bronzebeards and the Wildhammers are trying to thwart her viewing her as a traitor to her people. Yet, she uses her guile and cunning to gain the trust of Wrynn as well as others. She is a political badass. Although she probably only possesses the strength of Anduin, she has the brains to make a fool of Falstead and the motivation to do so. Even now, we don't know whether she's truly good or evil and that makes her an excellent character and I'd say that her tactics rival that of some of the strongest female roles around and she'll be a good character to keep an eye on.

04/04/2014 07:19 PMPosted by Terrå

not necessarily it would kind of be like STD's where if the baby is not born properly the infant can get the mothers STD. So in theory the baby could be born worgen.

This can't happen. From what CDev said the MAGICAL curse is not a disease, it's a magic spell. It needs a specific trigger to activate. You must be bitten, or drink the blood for the spell to activate.

Well that answer on the NE's leadership wasn't what I had hoped for. In my opinion Malfurion needs to be overthrown or at least killed off if both Tyrande and the Night Elf race are to move forward. I'd sort of like to see her take the title of "Queen" even though she's practically that power wise.

04/04/2014 06:31 PMPosted by Smoe

Malfurion is seen as incompetent because he is mostly neutral? The way I see it is like this: In cataclysm, Malfurion saw Ragnaros and Deathwing as the bigger threat because no matter who 'won' between the Horde and Alliance, they would still end the world. In this, he chose to form a temporary alliance with some horde faction members in order to root out the evil that would've plagued them after the war.

You read my threads right? He's not incompetent because he's neutral. In fact I don't think he is considered incompetent. People have varying opinions on this, and while I'm sure someone else would say he's incompetent for letting Leyara slip into madness and then proceeding to not show the slightest emotion to his failure, I think he might be a bit too perfect.

Have you read the WoW comics featuring Med'an? Most of the complaints about him came about because he was essentially what rpers call a Special Snowflake. He is a part Draenei part Orc part Human hybrid who had all the powers of every single class in the game and he was sent off to fight against the Old Gods while the rest of the world was concerned with the Scourge.

When you have characters like that, people become upset when they become literally too powerful for anyone else to handle. If he has all the powers of every single class in the game then what's the point of us then? Why not just send Med'an in there to blow whatever new villain away since he's so powerful that no one can beat him? You ever hear the old saying "Hardship builds character?" Well in this case it applies quite literally. If Med'an or Malfurion is so overwhelmingly powerful, he will never encounter any problems, and then his character development just ceases.

I've noticed this problem with both Thrall and Malfurion, as well as Varian now that I think of it. Now out of these three characters what do they all have in common? Chris Metzen, essentially the guy who's in charge of the Creative Development department that creates all the Lore holds favor with all three of them, explicitly saying that Malfurion was his favorite character and even voicing the other two.

And now let's look at their similarities: They are all leaders of extremely powerful factions (Malfurion of the Cenarion Circle), they all have superpowers even when it doesn't even make sense for them to have them, they all suck the character design out of any encompassing characters. Genn Greymane doesn't get any character development anymore and now just sits next to Varian doing nothing. Tyrande, primary leader of the Night Elven people for more then 10,000 years sits on her butt and does nothing all day expecting Malfurion to deal with the scary Horde for her. Even Aggra had a lot going for her until she married Thrall, now any new kind of lore we get about her is about her being a wife and a mother.

I think I've rambled on enough. Let's move onto the next quote.

04/04/2014 06:31 PMPosted by Smoe

Also, I don't think he's incompetent on the battlefield either considering he pushed back the burning legion twice and it was his idea to blow up the world tree to kill Archemond, thus saving all of Kalimdor from being engulfed by the scourge.

You're absolutely right. Malfurion is far from being incompetent on the battlefield. As mentioned from the above quote it should spell out his combat prowess. The problem lies in his neutrality, even despite being an Alliance leader. Even if Malfurion is overwhelmingly Alliance friendly and hates the Horde with a passion there will always be a reason why he's neutral, and that reason is his bane of existence: his power.

Because he is so overwhelmingly powerful, he could probably wipe out the entire Horde forces in Ashenvale if he tried, but in order to balance the game out, Blizzard made it so that could not happen. For balance reasons, they could either include Malfurion into the equation and explain how despite how Malfurion is fighting against the Horde he's not doing any good because of X. Or they could just not mention him at all, leave him out of the equation so people are left wondering if he is indeed neutral or not.

04/04/2014 06:31 PMPosted by Smoe

At the dawn of the Troll race, the ones who eventually became elves did so probably when they came into contact with Elune.

Actually it was because of the Well of Eternity.

04/04/2014 06:31 PMPosted by Smoe

Think of it as a dual-religioned theocracy where neither religion holds sway over the other because the vast majority of followers follow both religions.

So you're saying that Malfurion and Tyrande are taking advantage of Night Elves' tradition and are equating themselves to being Gods?

04/04/2014 06:31 PMPosted by Smoe

As for Tyrande being around Malfurion's arm at every turn, she spent 10,000 years of missing someone. They have catching up to do!

People's personalities don't change overnight. Even if Tyrande missed Malfurion as badly as you're portraying it, she wouldn't give up everything to be at Malfurion's side even if she says she will. She's been on the battlefield for over 10,000 years constantly fighting and defending her lands against unknown enemies.

Now with an organized threat of the Horde who has made their intentions clear on wanting to destroy their ancestral homeland in order to improve their own, you would think that Tyrande would be all over it. Even if her love for Malfurion is beyond words, you can't just place her into a subservient role. In that case, you'd be having Tyrande have to decide between the love of her husband or the love of her people.

If indeed her love for Malfurion is so powerful that it's able to change her from a heartless commanding general into a loving subservient wife, then I doubt she would have become a general at all. She would have spent the last 10,000 years doting over Malfurion's unconscious body worried that he might not ever come back.

04/04/2014 06:31 PMPosted by Smoe

Now, for that part where she gets second guessed in the trial of patience. She sees the Orcs that slaughtered many of her people and she wants to rush towards vindication knowing that their leader is somewhere in those lands and the only way to truly end the Warsong conflict is to end the Horde. It is in her best interest to kill those whelps and find their Warchief ASAP.

That makes sense, but it makes more sense that Blizzard realized that people preferred Warcraft 3 Tyrande to WoW Tyrande and were trying something new (or old) in order to change other people's opinions. That's probably also why we saw her destroying the gates to Orgrimmar when Malfurion was nowhere in sight.

04/04/2014 06:31 PMPosted by Smoe

Did you know that even though Illidain is called the 'Betrayer', Malfurion actually betrayed Illidain more times? Illidain was actually thinking of his people when he drew vials of the well of eternity and Malfurion probably created that misunderstanding in order to get Illidain out of the picture out of fear that Tyrande might view his brother as the better man. Why might Illidain be the better man? He's more compassionate than Malfurion! Before the sundering, Night Elves were second class citizens compared to the Highborn. After the destruction, Illidain sought to save his Highborn brothers from the catastrophic loss by taking some of the well water and making a new well to help them out. Another instance of Illidain's compassion is seen when he takes a curse upon himself in order to root out a Nathrazim and save his people. Malfurion then banishes his brother (probably to keep him and Tyrande separate). In doing so, he weakened his people greatly before the upcoming battle for the fate of Azeroth. Why? Because Illidain could've used the skull of Gul'dan to kill Archimonde without having to destroy the world tree and weakening the Night Elf race (and he would've sacrificed himself to do it if he had to). Despite joining the Legion, Illidain is a champion of all Elven kind be it the High, Blood, Naga, or Night Elves and Malfurion seeks to hide that in fear of losing Tyrande to the better man by keeping her in ignorance of it. Malfurion is an !@#$%^-, but a cunning one.

I'm not sure what you're trying to prove. You seem to be making my argument for me, that Malfurion's character should be remodeled into something different.

04/04/2014 06:31 PMPosted by Smoe

Tyrande is more compassionate than Malfurion,

Have you played any of Warcraft 3? While playing through the Reign of Chaos Night Elf Campaign it certainly seemed to me that Malfurion was far more compassionate than Tyrande, and seemed to make up the "hippy" character to balance out the "soldier" character that Tyrande was playing.

04/04/2014 06:31 PMPosted by Smoe

This is ultimately what drove Staghelm off the deep end,

Plus the death of his son.

I think you people are over-thinking the whole worgen thing.

The effects of the worgen curse are a (drum roll) curse. Curses are? You guessed it! Magic. It's magic, folks. I would advise that you not try to apply our Earth logic to a game of fantasy, especially one in which the wingspan of dragons is woefully small and insufficient to create enough lift to fly.

Blizzard can literally never be wrong in regards to how their story works. They wrote it, they're the be-all and end-all for all things regarding the canon of Warcraft, and to contest that is a bit silly. They can say the sky is pink because reasons and there would never be a way for you to tell them it isn't. They make the rules.

04/05/2014 01:58 AMPosted by Pherik

I think you people are over-thinking the whole worgen thing.

The effects of the worgen curse are a (drum roll) curse. Curses are? You guessed it! Magic. It's magic, folks. I would advise that you not try to apply our Earth logic to a game of fantasy, especially one in which the wingspan of dragons is woefully small and insufficient to create enough lift to fly.

First. People need to stop taking the word "Curse" so literally. It is not an actual curse. It's a magical condition that is highly "inconvenient" so they call it one.

No one casted a magic spell and said "Poof! I curse you to being a worgen!". It originated from druids drawing from a primal force and through a cluster of events let up to it both going out of control and affecting other people.

Second. The reason people are so upset is because it was up in the air rather or not Worgen where a new race created by magic (Like night elves, blood elves, and many others) or just humans with a condition (Like forsaken). And up to this point it was looking like the first.

Now it means that Worgen have no future as a race. And they might not even be one anymore.

There are no future generations of Worgen to take up the cause and be heroes, they are all just going to die out.

And given that they are in the running for the least developed playable race in the game you can see why the Worgen fans are so angry.

04/05/2014 01:58 AMPosted by Pherik

Blizzard can literally never be wrong in regards to how their story works. They wrote it, they're the be-all and end-all for all things regarding the canon of Warcraft, and to contest that is a bit silly. They can say the sky is pink because reasons and there would never be a way for you to tell them it isn't. They make the rules.

No one is saying Blizzard is wrong. They are just offering their criticisms on the subject as fans do. And the moment you stop accepting criticism is the moment you stop bettering yourself.

And Blizzard can be wrong, just ask the red shirt guy :P

04/04/2014 12:49 PMPosted by Amandalynn

He and Tyrande are Alliance faction leaders. So no, they don't have any future plans for them unless their child marries into the Hellscream clan.

Ouch, the truth hurts.

So... people ask questions about 'lore' and a Blizzard rep answers them. But now people are arguing with the answers? O.o

@ Vynathlon: First off, thank you for taking the time to read and respond man.

No, I haven't read the Medan comics. I usually prefer to experience the story as my character would which is also probably the reason you guys are more versed in the lore than me.

While I agree with you that Malfurion has too much power than he really needs, he has a tragic weakness that we've only seen exploited once or twice in the course of the game. His judgement falters when it comes to those who are close to him and he's also not that politically adept.

And I flat out disagree with you on Wrynn. He can't keep hold of his son for the life of him and it puts both of them in terrible positions. The main problem with this story wise was that the Horde didn't capitalize on it more than once. Also, he doesn't seem to know how to work his kingdom all that well either seeing the whole Westfall incident.

I flat out agree with you on Thrall though. He was taking the war out of Warcraft. Out of curiosity, what was going on with Aggra? I never really played a Hordie.

I thought Tyrande did more towards fighting the Horde than Malfurion though. And they do need to make more Gilnean lore like a push to retake South Shore or something. I'm sure we'll see more of him when Sylvannis comes in though.

04/04/2014 11:03 PMPosted by Vynathlon

Actually it was because of the Well of Eternity.

It was? I thought they were elves before that too.

04/04/2014 11:03 PMPosted by Vynathlon

So you're saying that Malfurion and Tyrande are taking advantage of Night Elves' tradition and are equating themselves to being Gods?

I kind of like this idea, in fact, there was a tin foil hat theory that said something like the Naaru were seeking to control Azeroth, but I do think that they legitimately care about their people. But I called it a theocracy because it was ruled by a 'High Priestess'.

04/04/2014 11:03 PMPosted by Vynathlon

People's personalities don't change overnight. Even if Tyrande missed Malfurion as badly as you're portraying it, she wouldn't give up everything to be at Malfurion's side even if she says she will. She's been on the battlefield for over 10,000 years constantly fighting and defending her lands against unknown enemies.

Now with an organized threat of the Horde who has made their intentions clear on wanting to destroy their ancestral homeland in order to improve their own, you would think that Tyrande would be all over it. Even if her love for Malfurion is beyond words, you can't just place her into a subservient role. In that case, you'd be having Tyrande have to decide between the love of her husband or the love of her people.

If indeed her love for Malfurion is so powerful that it's able to change her from a heartless commanding general into a loving subservient wife, then I doubt she would have become a general at all. She would have spent the last 10,000 years doting over Malfurion's unconscious body worried that he might not ever come back.

I really don't remember her being heartless. Of course, heartless to me would be like her kicking aside a dead sentinel who just took a bullet for her while calling her useless. And I don't think she's fully subservient either. But again, I don't read the comics. I only know the lore from the games. I also think her main problem in the Warsong conflict so far is that she didn't know how far the Horde was willing to go in the conflict and many of her troops were tied up on another front.

04/04/2014 11:03 PMPosted by Vynathlon

I'm not sure what you're trying to prove. You seem to be making my argument for me, that Malfurion's character should be remodeled into something different.

Malfurion is insecure. That's all. It could also be another thing that could be used against him come to think of it.

I remember Tyrande being hot headed but I think she is more compassionate when it comes to her people than Malfurion who seems to view them as another part of nature.

04/04/2014 11:03 PMPosted by Vynathlon

Plus the death of his son.

That only turned him into a brooding, angsty teenager. His major reason for siding with Ragnaros was his political disagreement with Tyrande and Malfurion. Now, this was shaped by the death of his son but I believe that it really stemmed from his belief that it would be better to deal a deathblow to the Horde before turning towards Ragnaros.